Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

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Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

John Magolske
Hi,

I have an X31 ThinkPad on which I've installed Debian Stable 7.6.0.
Getting suspend-to-ram is turning out to be a major PITA. I typed
the following into a Linux console:

    rmmod ehci_hcd uhci_hcd ipw2100
    pm-suspend --quirk-radeon-off

The screen turns off for a brief moment, then comes back on with the
little crescent-moon indicator lit as well. Then, when woken, the the
screen goes off altogether and the Caps lock indicator light starts
blinking. Reading through PM-ACTION(8), I see there all sorts of
"quirks" to try out... I've tried various combinations of the above
along with --quirk-dpms-suspend --quirk-s3-bios --quirk-s3-mode etc...
The only way I can get the display to turn off is by issuing the
command `radeontool light off` just before the pm-suspend command.

And in all cases, this laptop will not wake from it's sleep.

The video card is a "mobility radeon 7000".

This is a 3.2.0 kernel:

    uname -a
    ... 3.2.0-4-486 #1 Debian 3.2.60-1+deb7u3 i686 GNU/Linux

and the most recent BIOS [1]:

    dmidecode -s bios-version
     1QET97WW (3.02 )

Anyone out there successfully suspending to RAM an X31?

Any clues much appreciated!

John

----

[1] Seems to be current per:
http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/BIOS_Upgrade_Downloads
btw, that points to a dead link:
http://support.lenovo.com/en_US/downloads/detail.page?&LegacyDocID=MIGR-50298
Lenovo seems to have a lot of dead links around BIOS updates for older
machines ... you can find the page archived on archive.org's wayback
machine and pull the BIOS Update Utility download from there.

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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

John Magolske
Thanks everyone for the suggestions, see comments in-line below.

I went ahead and upgraded from Debian Stable to Testing thinking maybe
a more recent kernel and more recent versions of uswsusp (package that
provides s2ram) & pm-utils might help. Unfortunately, still unable to
suspend to RAM.

* Dan Saint-Andre <[hidden email]> [141004 15:39]:
> The last time I fought this issue, I learned that suspend-to-RAM
> [aka, sleep] required a suitable swap space.

A swap partition is set up and the `free` command shows available space.

* Stefan Monnier <[hidden email]> [141004 16:19]:
> Which X11 driver are you using?  If you use the Free Software one, then
> I can't help, but if you're using the proprietary driver, then I'd
> suggest you try the Free Software driver instead.

I'm not starting up X, my sequence is boot up into a framebuffer
console, log in as root, issue commands -- rmmod to unload some
modules then pm-suspend or s2ram with various options.

In terms of graphics card drivers, after upgrading to Testing there
was something new when booting up:

    radeon 0000:01:00.0: firmware: failed to load radeon/R100_cp.bin
    [drm:r100_cp_init] *ERROR* Failed to load firmware!
    radeon 0000:01:00.0: failed initializing CP (-12).
    radeon 0000:01:00.0: Disabling GPU acceleration

So per suggestions on a forum somewhere that discussed those error
messages and a Radeon card (but not having to do with suspend issues)
I installed the firmware-linux-nonfree package and those error
messages went away. But the not-waking-from-suspend issue remained.
Although now, instead of a blank screen I see vertical stripes, two
clusters of three going from the bottom of the screen to the top.

> You might also like to try `s2ram' instead of `pm-suspend' (using
> pm-suspend runs s2ram, but by removing the extra stuff that pm-suspend
> does might help track down the origin of the problem).

I actually tried s2ram first, but read somewhere it was deprecated
in favour of pm-suspend. I don't think pm-suspend runs s2ram, as I
un-installed uswsusp did `which s2ram` saw "s2ram not found" and
and pm-suspend kept functioning as before.

* Alexandre Kalmeijer <[hidden email]> [141005 11:06]:
> Google for TLP and configure it to your needs.
> RESTORE_DEVICE_STATE_ON_STARTUP= should solve your problems with
> hibernation/ sleep.

Hadn't heard of TLP before, so I went ahead and installed it. Looks
like an interesting alternative to laptop-tools, will have to play
with it later to see how it does with battery life. Unfortunately, for
now I find it does not do anything to alleviate my wake from suspend
issues.

One other thing I tried last night is installing OpenBSD on this
machine. I'd heard ThinkPad support is decent with OpenBSD as the devs
"dogfood" & use thinkpads when running thier OS. Running the `zzz`
command to suspend seemed to work a little nicer -- the screen turned
off without a need for anything like `radeontool light off` ... but
on waking from sleep the display was frozen with lots of vertical
stripes.

I'm wondering if the issue is just that this is an old graphics card
that is no longer supported... granted it is a pretty old machine by
today's standards. But it has IMO a very nice keyboard, I like the
"tall-screen" format, and it has enough power for my needs (running a
shell, tmux, vim, elinks, ncmpcpp etc).

In any case, any further clues appreciated!

John


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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

Richard Neill-4

On 09/10/14 16:14, John Magolske wrote:
>
> * Dan Saint-Andre <[hidden email]> [141004 15:39]:
>> The last time I fought this issue, I learned that suspend-to-RAM
>> [aka, sleep] required a suitable swap space.

I don't think it does. Except when you want to use the added feature of
"suspend to ram + disk", where it will wake from RAM if it can, but if
the battery dies, the system will resume from disk. In that case, your
swap partition must exceed the size of the RAM (and there might be
issues with encrypted swap).

> In any case, any further clues appreciated!

Can I suggest that you try a selection of distros with live USB keys,
and see whether any of them work from the USB key?

This is also a very quick way you could try to search through historical
distros as well as the most modern ones.  My inclination would be to
scan through a dozen ubuntu live-CDs, (use unetbootin to make the
environment work off a USB-stick).

Also, I recall 3 possible sources of previous trouble.

1. Sometimes kernel modesetting can be a problem.

2. Double suspend: 2 sets of scripts both race against each other to
sleep - eg Fn-F4 followed by lid-close. I've noticed some cases when the
machine

3. A long time ago, I had trouble with X being at fault. The trick  was
to chvt 1 ; killall -STOP X;   before sleeping, and then the reverse on
wake.  My A22p (similar hardware) had this issue:
http://richardneill.org/a22p-mdk11-0.php#suspend


Lastly, I recall that for some generations of thinkpad hardware, in
about that era, there were two ways to get suspend, one of which used
APM and the other ACPI. You might wish to try both.  [However, this is a
distant memory; it may be unreliable!!]


One final thing: it's not always clear whether the X-server and GPU are
crashed while the kernel is alive. When the machine is non-responsive,
can you at least ping it? Debugging sleep scripts is much easier over
SSH (especially if you configure a static IP with wired ethernet: your
SSH connection should survive a sleep/wake cycle if it is quick enough).


HTH

Richard



>
> John
>
>
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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

Jochen Spieker
Richard Neill:
> On 09/10/14 16:14, John Magolske wrote:
>> * Dan Saint-Andre <[hidden email]> [141004 15:39]:
>>>
>>> The last time I fought this issue, I learned that suspend-to-RAM
>>> [aka, sleep] required a suitable swap space.
>
> I don't think it does.

You are right. I don't have any swap at all any my X240 suspends (and
resumes) just fine.

The only issue I had recently was related to xscreensaver locking my
screen before suspend. It looked like resume failed (black screen, only
mouse cursor visible) but killing xscreensaver helped. I found many
others with similar problems. But that won't help the OP since he
doesn't run X.

> 1. Sometimes kernel modesetting can be a problem.

ACK, on old machines it might be worth a try to disable KMS.

> One final thing: it's not always clear whether the X-server and GPU
> are crashed while the kernel is alive. When the machine is
> non-responsive, can you at least ping it? Debugging sleep scripts is
> much easier over SSH (especially if you configure a static IP with
> wired ethernet: your SSH connection should survive a sleep/wake
> cycle if it is quick enough).

ACK, see my experience above.

J.
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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

Stefan Monnier
In reply to this post by John Magolske
>     radeon 0000:01:00.0: firmware: failed to load radeon/R100_cp.bin
>     [drm:r100_cp_init] *ERROR* Failed to load firmware!
>     radeon 0000:01:00.0: failed initializing CP (-12).
>     radeon 0000:01:00.0: Disabling GPU acceleration

> So per suggestions on a forum somewhere that discussed those error
> messages and a Radeon card (but not having to do with suspend issues)
> I installed the firmware-linux-nonfree package and those error
> messages went away.

Good.

> But the not-waking-from-suspend issue remained.
> Although now, instead of a blank screen I see vertical stripes, two
> clusters of three going from the bottom of the screen to the top.

Other than the display not being right, does the machine wake up
correctly (e.g. can you connect to it from the network?  or can you
blind-type and get the expected behavior in return?).

> in favour of pm-suspend. I don't think pm-suspend runs s2ram, as I
> un-installed uswsusp did `which s2ram` saw "s2ram not found" and
> and pm-suspend kept functioning as before.

pm-suspend can use various underlying mechanisms.  If s2ram is installed
(by default) it uses it, otherwise I think it uses /sys/power/state.

> I'm wondering if the issue is just that this is an old graphics card
> that is no longer supported... granted it is a pretty old machine by
> today's standards.

Usually support for old hardware is kept for a long time, so it's
unlikely, but of course possible (e.g. in my X30, the KMS code does not
handle my graphics card correctly, so I had to force the use of the
non-KMS code).


        Stefan

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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

John Magolske
In reply to this post by Richard Neill-4
* Richard Neill <[hidden email]> [141009 09:58]:
> Can I suggest that you try a selection of distros with live USB keys,
> and see whether any of them work from the USB key?
>
> This is also a very quick way you could try to search through
> historical distros as well as the most modern ones.

Interesting idea... from my readings across the net, at one point in
history it appears the X31 did successfully suspend & resume under
Linux. Maybe some distant kernel/driver combo? I read somewhere that
the X31 requires all USB devices to be unmounted (& maybe unplugged)
when doing a suspend/resume. There are some live CD/USB distros that
load everything to RAM allowing the USB drive to be unplugged, maybe
I'll take a look at some of those.

> Lastly, I recall that for some generations of thinkpad hardware, in about
> that era, there were two ways to get suspend, one of which used APM and the
> other ACPI. You might wish to try both.  [However, this is a distant memory;
> it may be unreliable!!]

I did try passing acpi=off to the kernel, which if I understand
correctly will activate APM, but this had no effect.

> One final thing: it's not always clear whether the X-server and GPU are
> crashed while the kernel is alive. When the machine is non-responsive, can
> you at least ping it? Debugging sleep scripts is much easier over SSH
> (especially if you configure a static IP with wired ethernet: your SSH
> connection should survive a sleep/wake cycle if it is quick enough).

I haven't tried pinging / debugging over SSH yet...it's on my todo
list (only have bits of time here & there to tinker with this).

Regards,

John

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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

John Magolske
In reply to this post by Stefan Monnier
* Stefan Monnier <[hidden email]> [141014 12:09]:
> Other than the display not being right, does the machine wake up
> correctly (e.g. can you connect to it from the network?  or can you
> blind-type and get the expected behavior in return?).

Blind-typing has no effect (e.g. `sudo halt -p`), still a stubbornly
frozen screen.

> > I'm wondering if the issue is just that this is an old graphics card
> > that is no longer supported...
>
> Usually support for old hardware is kept for a long time, so it's
> unlikely, but of course possible (e.g. in my X30, the KMS code does
> not handle my graphics card correctly, so I had to force the use of
> the non-KMS code).

What steps did you take to force the use of non-KMS code? Would that
be passing "nomodeset" to the kernel when booting? (tried that also,
to no effect).

*

I did learn a bit more running OpenBSD -- passing "disable radeondrm"
at boot I was able to successfully suspend and resume fine. The only
wrinkle is that the back light would turn on right after everything
went to sleep [1]. Well, that and no video acceleration.

Grasping at straws:

I read a post [2] mentioning the "Thinkvantage Configuration Utility".
Evidently you need to boot into Windows to run this utility. This was
for a different issue, but I'm wondering what configurations are in
there and where they are stored ... machine settings not available
via the BIOS? If I can dig up the hard-drive that has my old Windows
install on it I may look into this.

[1] http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.os.openbsd.misc/216558
[2] http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=1171022

Regards,

John

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fle
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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

fle
In reply to this post by John Magolske
hi,
in this post I describe how I was abble to suspend with an X32
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2249876&p=13151609#post13151609

However, the GPU is not powered down, so that the autonomy when suspended is just a couple of hours.
regards
fle
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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

fle
I've been able to solve the power management issue. See the link.

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2249876&p=13165175#post13165175
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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

Uwe Brauer-2
>> "fle" == fle  <[hidden email]> writes:

   > I've been able to solve the power management issue. See the link.
   > http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2249876&p=13165175#post13165175
Hi

I presume this should work for a X60s as well. (But since it could have
a different graphic card I am not really sure)


However when I added

    edit /etc/initramfs-tools/modules and add the line "radeonfb"
and run
    sudo update-initramfs -u

I obtained
W: Possible missing firmware /lib/firmware/radeon/
SUMO2_me.bin for module radeon
W: Possible missing firmware /lib/firmware/radeon/
SUMO2_pfp.bin for module radeon
etc

So I presume some deb for radeon are missing. Can you tell me what you
have installed?

Uwe Brauer

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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

gregor herrmann-2
On Fri, 14 Nov 2014 09:26:15 +0100, Uwe Brauer wrote:

> I obtained
> W: Possible missing firmware /lib/firmware/radeon/
> SUMO2_me.bin for module radeon
> W: Possible missing firmware /lib/firmware/radeon/
> SUMO2_pfp.bin for module radeon
> etc

% apt-file search SUMO2_me.bin
firmware-linux-nonfree: /lib/firmware/radeon/SUMO2_me.bin
% apt-file search SUMO2_pfp.bin
firmware-linux-nonfree: /lib/firmware/radeon/SUMO2_pfp.bin


gregor

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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

Uwe Brauer-2
>> "gregor" == gregor herrmann <[hidden email]> writes:

   > On Fri, 14 Nov 2014 09:26:15 +0100, Uwe Brauer wrote:

   > % apt-file search SUMO2_me.bin
   > firmware-linux-nonfree: /lib/firmware/radeon/SUMO2_me.bin
   > % apt-file search SUMO2_pfp.bin
   > firmware-linux-nonfree: /lib/firmware/radeon/SUMO2_pfp.bin

thanks did not occur to me use apt-file search?

Uwe

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Re: Trying to get Suspend to RAM working on an X31

John Magolske
In reply to this post by fle
Hi,

* fle <[hidden email]> [141112 15:06]:
> I've been able to solve the power management issue. See the link.
> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2249876&p=13165175#post13165175

Thanks for passing this along. I've pasted some of what you wrote in
that linked forum post here along with my comments and commentary on
what's worked for me.

> So as a summary, these are my settings :
>
> 0- install xubuntu 14.04

Just for reference, I believe xubuntu 14.04 would have a 3.13.7 kernel,
and I'm running a 3.16.5 kernel.

> 1- etc/default/grub settings :
>
> GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash nomodeset video=radeonfb:force_sleep"
> then update-grub

These options work for me as well. The boot parameter I found earlier
( https://www.libreoffice.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=38554#c2 )
that allowed resume from suspend to work was "radeon.modeset=0"
(nomodeset by itself did not work), so I simply used this:

    GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet radeon.modeset=0"

That along with this suspend script did the job:

    #!/bin/sh
    sudo ifdown eth1
    sudo iwconfig eth1 txpower off
    sudo rmmod ehci_pci
    sudo rmmod ehci_hcd
    sudo rmmod uhci_hcd
    # Switch to vt6 to run pm-suspend (issues with backlight staying
    # on when done from X), stay in vt6 for a sec when waking to make
    # sure everything wakes up before switching back to X...
    FGCONSOLE=`fgconsole`
    chvt 6
    sleep 1
    /usr/sbin/pm-suspend --quirk-radeon-off
    sleep 1
    chvt $FGCONSOLE
    sudo modprobe uhci_hcd
    sudo modprobe ehci_hcd
    sudo modprobe ehci_pci
    sudo iwconfig eth1 txpower off

(pm-suspend doesn't work in X (I'm running X now), that's why this
switches to another VT to run pm-suspend. Not sure how important is
is to unload & reload those modules, or if it would help to unload
more...)

Now resume from suspend was working, but I noticed a less responsive
display, more hysteresis when re-sizing & dragging around windows in
cwm as well as a more sluggish and stuttering linewise scrolling in
Vim, etc. On a whim I tried `modprobe radeonfb`, and lo, the graphics
were more responsive -- no more sluggish stuttering hysteresis. But
the colors were all messed up... seemed to be a color depth issue.
Putting this in /etc/X11/xorg.conf fixed it:

     Section "Screen"
             Identifier "Screen0"
             DefaultDepth  24
     EndSection

> 2- use of radeonfb :
> as here http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Problem_with_high_power_drain_in_ACPI_sleep

Some relevant info on that page I somehow overlooked the last time I
took a look at it... The ACPI_sleep_power_drain_test_script looks like
it could be useful for troubleshooting. Also, this:

    You must use a recent (or patched) version of the radeonfb driver,
    even if you are only interested in using the X window system. The
    radeon frame buffer suspends the radeon chip correctly during ACPI
    sleep. Starting with linux 2.6.18, this patch is in the official
    (kernel.org) kernels.

> * edit /etc/initramfs-tools/modules and add the line "radeonfb"
> * sudo update-initramfs -u
> * edit /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist-framebuffer and comment out the line
>   "blacklist radeonfb"

I tried this approach, but found that it took longer to log into X and
longer to resume from suspend than when loading radeonfb *after* X is
running. So I added `sudo modprobe radeonfb &` to my ~/.xinitrc file.
A non-standard way to load kernel modules, but here's what I found:

Approach A - modprobe radeonfb in ~/.xinitrc
--------------------------------------------

9s to grub prompt
33s to login prompt
7s after login till visible cursor in X

Suspend to RAM:
5s to sleep
6-7s to wake

Suspend to disk:
10s to sleep
22s to wake

Approach B - via /etc/initramfs-tools/modules
---------------------------------------------

9s to grub prompt
35s to login prompt
15s after login till visible cursor in X

Suspend to RAM:
6s to sleep
15s to wake

Suspend to disk:
12s to sleep
32s to wake

By loading radeonfb the more "correct" way, the resume from suspend to
RAM time got bumped up from 7 to 15 seconds -- a bit longer than I'd
like, and also getting close to the 22 seconds for resuming from the
suspend-to-disk in approach A...which I'm thinking can be shaved down
even more by switching from a spinning magnetic HD to an SSD.

And suspend-to-disk is working pretty reliably running `pm-hibernate`
(within X, no need to switch to another VT) -- 55 hibernate/resume
cycles so far without fail.

Suspend to RAM on the other hand still occasionally fails to resume,
forcing a hard reboot (blank screen, no backlight, keyboard input not
recognized). This seems to happen about 1 time in 25, which really
isn't reliable enough for me. Haven't tried many suspend-to-ram/resume
cycles with the addition of the /etc/pm/config.d/99_ATI_RADEON
outlined below along with passing the "video=radeonfb:force_sleep"
boot parameter, maybe I'll try that next to see if it reduces
frequency of this resume failure.

At this point however I'm leaning towards going with suspend-to-disk
as a "sleep" solution. Will see if after swapping in an SSD that might
be reasonably fast enough. I was wondering if repeated suspend-to-disk
cycling might hurt an SSD, but this comment claims it's not a problem:

http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-2214313/hibernate-mode-ssd.html#response-13691628

> 3- then create the /etc/pm/config.d/99_ATI_RADEON file, as said previously with the following :
>
> DROP_PARAMETERS=all
> ADD_PARAMETERs="--quirk-radeon-off --quirk-save-pci"

I had suspend/resume working ok without the "--quirk-save-pci" option,
but am adding it in for good measure along with "DROP_PARAMETERS=all",
will see how it works going forward.

> 4- install radeontool via the software center

Did you end up using radeontool for anything? I tried it in my suspend
script to no avail. What I found is that the machine would go to
sleep, backlight shut off, then immediately *after* the machine was
asleep the backlight would pop back on. The only thing that would
prevent this was passing the "--quirk-radeon-off" option. Also, fwiw
http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Radeontool claims that radeontool is
deprecated, with the suggestion to use xrandr and sysfs instead.

* * * *

One workaround to the X31/X32 suspend/resume problems suggested to me
was to run an older kernel & version of X. Haven't tried running an
older kernel yet... but if choosing to do so, this indicates problems
started after kernel 2.6.31:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/561926/comments/9

I'd prefer to stay with a more recent kernel to catch security
bug-fixes & such. For now I'm happy enough with suspend-to-disk
working reliably as-is. Hopefully the solution of using radeonfb and
the various other options listed above will continue to work in the
face any future changes to the radeon drivers, for example:

AMD Radeon Graphics Get Many Changes For Linux 3.17
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTc1NTg

[pull] radeon drm-next-3.17
http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/dri-devel/2014-August/065525.html

Regards,

John

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John Magolske
http://B79.net/contact
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